CHR and Females 18-34 - Follow-Up

Something that’s been bugging me is related to your answer about females and Top 40.  Looking at the “Billboard” charts from the 50s, 60s, and 70s, the Oldies stations I have sampled over the air, the Internet, and on the Dish, do NOT play what was most popular during those decades for the most part, but rather play “rock and roll” hits from those eras.

 

I’ve noticed the 80s station off the Dish focuses on “alternative” 80s hits instead of the true top 100 from each year.  That’s not true of most 80s channels/stations, but this one does.

 

Why in particular would the 50s/60s/70s stations avoid the biggest hits of the day (perhaps Pat Boone, Andy Williams, Henry Mancini, other MOR artists) in favor of the rock?  I understand some stations, but most or all?

 

I’m only 33, but I imagine growing up in the 60s with music by The Limelighters and other “tame” hits on the radio, then listening to “Oldies” radio today and hearing the rock that maybe I avoided as a teen in favor of Top 40.

 

Is it because the pop music of the day was dance music generally, and those females who listened are still listening to current top 40 as you suggested?  Go with the rock to attract the male crowd that wanted it louder, harder, and faster?

 

I like all of it.  I’m just curious from a research standpoint.  Thanks. - Gene

 

Gene:  Good observation and I think you already answered your question.

 

If you look at the charts from the 50s and 60s, you’ll notice a mixture of music from folk songs (“Hey, it’s a Hootenanny”…you have to be older to know what that means) to various types of “adult” songs by Pat Boone, Andy Williams, and others (as you mentioned), to various types of rock music.

 

Why all this stuff on the same music chart?  Two reasons: (1) Because the Top 40 stations at that time played all types of music (I can remember when WLS-AM in Chicago played Calcutta by Lawrence Welk); and (2) There weren’t individual format charts as there are today—just one “Top 40” chart that included all sorts of stuff.

 

Now, some of the songs listed on the charts from the 50s and 60s may have been popular then, but they don’t fit with some Oldies formats on the radio today.  Where does Lawrence Welk fit in?  I don’t know.

 

I think the option for most Oldies radio stations is to concentrate on the music that is somewhat similar to more current music, and that means rock music, not Pat Boone, Henry Mancini, and Lawrence Welk (and other similar stuff).

CHR and TSL

Hi Doc: Given the fact that CHR stations play the most popular current songs many times over, is it not natural for a CHR station to have low TSL?  If yes, what could a programmer possibly do to extend the TSL as much as possible?  Thanks for your time! - Anonymous

 

Anon: Time spent listening (TSL) is a function of several programming elements.  TSL increases as a radio station provides more elements that are interesting to listeners.  However, for music radio stations, a large portion of the hours spent listening relates to the music played.  If listeners get tired of hearing the same songs, they will switch to another entertainment source.  This has always been true.

 

The problem is that many radio programmers (and others) continue to believe the philosophy of the early Top 40 radio stations developed by Todd Storz and Gordon McLendon — play a short list of popular songs so listeners always hear something they like.

 

That philosophy is fine, but by its very nature, it restricts TSL.  Sure, listeners get to hear popular songs frequently, but when the popular songs are played every few hours, listeners become frustrated and go somewhere else.

 

As I mentioned, TSL is a function of all programming elements.  If you are programming a CHR/Top 40 radio station, you need to find out what your listeners want.  Do they like the rotation?  How long do they listen before going to another source?  Is repetition a problem?  And so on.

 

The key to success of a CHR radio station, just like the success of any other radio format, is to find out what the listeners want and give it to them.  If you program a CHR radio station, don't just give them the same thing that was given to listeners in the 1950s — find out what your listeners want.  That is the only way to increase TSL.

CHR – Lower TSL

Hey Doc, I'm in a pickle and was wondering if you could help.  I've been the PD of a CHR Top 40 Mainstream radio station for the past 2 years.  Since I started the job, one thing that has driven me nuts is the amount of news we run.  We run news twice an hour from 6a to 9a, and also run news at 10, 11, 2, 3, 4, and 5p.  I'm not talking about headlines, I'm talking about a full blown two-minute news report complete with a one minute sponsor following news, followed by a sports report, weather forecast, and a weather sponsor (approximately five minutes total).

 

Now for the facts.  Our TSL is consistently horrible in every demo and in every book.  I maintain that this low TSL is the result of two completely different products being marketed to the consumer.  According to Arbitron, the median age of a CHR listener is 25 (female), while the median age of someone who listens to News radio is 54 (male).  My GM maintains that the low TSL is the result of the format.  In a nutshell, is there any evidence that running big segments of news all day long on a CHR lowers TSL?  Any information would help! - TSL is in the crapper

 

TSL:  First, I can’t recall ever seeing research for a CHR radio station indicating that listeners want a lot of news.  However, there is no specific definition for “a lot,” and I don’t know if your listeners think you have too much news or not.  You would have to ask them, but from your comments, I don’t think you have done that.  (Yes, I know that research is expensive, but it’s only your product.)

 

Second, you are relating your low TSL to the amount of news you have.  I don’t know if that is correct or not.  TSL (Time Spent Listening) is a multivariate (many variable) concept.  That is, TSL isn’t produced only by the amount of news you have on the air.  TSL is developed from a combination of programming elements like music, service elements, jocks, commercials, formatics, and everything else.  The amount of news you have may be a problem, but from the research I have done, my guess is that there is probably something else contributing to the situation.  I may be wrong, but I have a tough time believing that news is the only contributor to the low TSL.

CHR Music Promos

We are in a competitive Top 50 market, and battling another CHR station.  We are considering running music promos just to give the station an image of being hotter, and first with new music.  However, I’m now hearing that the research on this is negative and CHR listeners hate music promos.  Does this really hurt more than this helps?  Thanks you.  We enjoy the column! - Anonymous

 

Anon:  I’m glad you enjoy the column.  Thanks.

 

I don’t know what you mean by, “I’m now hearing that the research on this is negative and CHR listeners hate music promos.”  Who said this?  Where did you hear it?  Where is the research?  If there is research, were your listeners in the sample?

 

I gots ta have proof for that statement, and so should you.  Don’t rely on what you hear or read, and don’t apply what you hear or read to your radio station.

 

I haven’t seen any research on this topic, but that doesn’t mean it hasn’t been done.  There may be several studies that investigate the importance of music promos with CHR listeners, but if the research doesn’t include your listeners, then there is no reason to pay attention to it.

 

As I have said many times in this column (and elsewhere), we learn things in four ways: authority, intuition, tenacity, and the scientific method.  While the first three methods of learning are OK in some situations, you need to rely on the scientific method for such things as decisions about airing music promos.  Don’t rely on “he said/she said” things, or “I’m hearing…” things. 

 

I can’t tell you what you should do because I’m not one of your listeners.  You need to ask them.  But I know that it’s sometimes impossible to do that, so in some cases, the only thing you have left is to rely on your experience and judgment.  If you and your colleagues believe that music promos fit with your overall approach, then you should put them on.  I don’t favor this approach, but sometimes it’s necessary.

CHR Questions

This may also apply to other formats, but my intrigue is with CHR…What is the "spoke" system? Also, why daypart? If a CHR has a target demo, why do many CHR radio stations shift their music mix at night? Do they not want to hit the same target at night as they do during the day? - Anonymous

 

Anon: You are correct in assuming that your questions don’t relate only to CHR.  The "spoke system?" I found two possible definitions. First, this may refer to the term "hub and spoke" system and it emerged from companies trying to cut costs. For example, a person in Denver receives news and other information from sister stations in other markets. This person (a jock or news anchor or someone else), then broadcasts the "local" information back to the sister stations in the other markets. In other words, the "hub" radio station broadcasts music or non-music to the "spokes"—sometimes at different times and sometimes the material is sent simultaneously. Basically, "hub and spoke" is another term for "network."

 

Secondly, the spoke system may refer to music clocks. As consultant Terry Patrick explained to me, "It’s like the spokes in a bicycle wheel. Most commonly, it means you are never one song (spoke) from a core song (a core sound or a Power.)"

 

Now to your question about dayparting. I’m sure there are many reasons why a CHR (or any other radio station) would daypart and play different songs at night, but the most common reason is to provide a little variety to the radio station. In some cases, radio stations will test new music at night to judge the listeners’ reactions.

 

Yes, radio stations do have a target, but if you listen to a CHR (for example) you’ll notice that the music at night (hopefully) falls in the CHR arena. In other words, the CHR would not play Country music at night. That don’t be right.

CHR Rotation

Dear Doctor: A friend at a CHR in a distant market has their playlist set up in a way I have not considered before: 30 currents, some that play all dayparts, some that only play during the day, and some that only play at night.  I'm used to the standard heavy, medium, and light.  Is my friend’s approach common among mainstream CHR stations? - Anonymous

 

Anon:  I called two of my CHR PD friends and both said that this is not a unique rotation scheme, although the majority of CHR radio station’s tend to use the typical “heavy, medium, light” rotation approach.

 

I’m not aware of any specific articles on CHR rotations, but try this Internet search I set up for you.

CHR Rotation - Two

Hi. Doctor:  A CHR station rotates faster its songs than, for example, an AC station.  If you don't have a research study (format finder), how can you determine or calculate the time a song needs to repeat itself inside a category, no matter what the format is?  For example, on a CHR station, how do I know if a song should be repeated every 2:20 hours or 2:40 hours, etc.? - Anonymous

 

Anon:  First, I need to clear up one thing with your question.  You mention that you don’t have a “format finder” to help determine your rotation.  A “format finder” or “format hole study” is designed to search for an available format in the market and doesn’t usually include anything about TSL (Time Spent Listening) to individual radio stations.  Specific listening behavior is usually included in research studies, but not a format hole search.

 

On to your question…

 

As you probably know, there isn’t a “Rotation Rule” carved in concrete for PDs to follow.  While there are probably many approaches to determining music rotation, two approaches seem to emerge most often in discussions about rotation.  Which one makes most sense to you?

 

Turnover:  For the readers who don’t know, audience turnover is an estimate of the number of times a radio station’s audience changes in a given daypart.  Turnover is computed by dividing a station’s cume audience by its average persons total (both numbers are reported in Arbitron ratings books.)  By the way, Arbitron’s book, Turning the Numbers into Sales Solutions, shows the Turnover formula, along with many other formulas you may find helpful.

 

A CHR radio station usually has a high turnover—in most situations, higher than any other format in the market.  This isn’t a bad thing.  It just means that the listeners come in and out more frequently.  OK, so let’s assume that your turnover is 2.0 for a specific daypart.  This means that you have two audiences during that time and should probably play the Power songs every two hours (Remember that this is only an example—you’ll need to figure out the turnover for your radio station.)

 

One more thing…You should computer Turnover for each of your dayparts to see if they are the same or different (they will probably be different).  Assuming that’s true, then you may want to have different rotation schemes for each daypart.

 

TSL:  You can also use Time Spent Listening to compute your rotation.  The national average TSL for CHR radio stations (according to Arbitron) is 8.0 hours (total week).  This means that, on average, listeners tune in between 1-2 hours per day.  This may be in one “sitting,” or it may be over several “sittings.”  You don’t know.

 

OK.  A 1-2 hour daily TSL, indicates that you should play your Power songs about every 90 minutes or so.  Your second category (whatever you call it), probably rotates about every 3 hours, and your third category spins about every 5 hours.  (This is only a suggestion—calculate your own average TSL.)

 

One of the main reasons people listen to music radio is to hear their favorite songs.  If your listeners tune in for 1-2 each day, you probably should have the top songs playing.  That’s why you’ll have a short turn-around with the songs.  The people in your radio station will go crazy because they hear the same songs all the time, but remember that the employees aren’t your target audience.

Christian Radio

Doctor:  Why all the information on Christian radio, especially here at “All Access?”  It is a fringe format at best.  I don’t know anybody who listens to such stuff.  Is it all southerners and small town people?  I live in a good-sized city on the west coast, and I don’t know of any station that does that format—the listeners are too sophisticated here. - Anonymous

 

Anon:  This isn’t a short answer, so you may want to get a 6-pack of your favorite drink.  I’ll make a few comments first, and then turn it over to someone who knows more than I do about your question.

 

First, your comment that, “I don’t know anybody who listens to such stuff,” reminds me of the comment by the sheriff in Australia when he was asked what he thought about Neil Armstrong taking the first step on the moon.  The sheriff said something like, “I don’t believe it.  I have been looking up at the moon for a long time and I can’t see anyone up there.”  Well OK then.

 

Don’t be offended, but just because you don’t know anyone who listens to Christian radio doesn’t mean that there aren’t people who do listen.  Know what I mean?

 

There is an argument of fallacy known as, “Post hoc ergo prompter hoc,” a Latin term that means, “After this therefore because of this.”  This fallacy is committed when a person assumes that because one thing follows another, that the one thing was caused by the other.  In other words, “I don’t know anyone who listens to Christian radio, therefore no one listens to Christian radio.”  Before you pass judgment on the number of Christian radio listeners, you need to broaden your horizon of audience research beyond your sample of one.

 

Next, you say, “Is it all southerners and small town people?”  Hmm…people who live in the north, west, east and in larger towns and cities don’t listen to Christian radio stations?  This sounds like a “sweeping generalization” to me.  The Latin phrase for this argument of fallacy is: “A dicto simpliciter ad dictum secundum quid,” or an informal fallacy of applying a rule to a particular case without considering the qualifying features that might be an exception to the rule.

 

Do you have data to support your statement about southerners and/or small town people, or are you merely pigeon holing these people based on some belief about the characteristics (specifically place of residence) of people who are Christians or who listen to Christian radio?  I gots ta know.

 

Finally, you say, “I live in a good-sized city on the west coast, and I don’t know of any station that does that format—the listeners are too sophisticated here.”  Wait a minute here.  Christian music and sophistication are related?  I’m not sure how you define “sophisticated,” but I need some facts to support your statement.  Right now, your argument is: Unsophisticated = Listen to Christian radio stations; Sophisticated = Listen to all other radio stations.  Gag me with a beaker.  I need facts, my friend.

 

OK, so what do we have here?  You’re wondering why there is so much attention paid to Christian radio stations because you don’t know anyone who listen to them, there aren’t any Christian radio stations on the west coast because people who live there are too sophisticated to listen to such stations, and the only people who listen to Christian radio stations are unsophisticated people who live in the south and/or small towns.  Hmm.

 

Lacking any supporting data, I can only assume that your comments are personal opinions.  Now…there is nothing wrong with personal opinions and you are free to express them.  However, as a researcher, I discount personal opinions when it comes to trying to describe or predict a phenomenon, concept, or construct.  In addition, I’m not an expert on Christian radio stations.  When I face a situation where I don’t have enough information, I go to someone who does.  And that’s what I did here.

 

I sent your question to Brad Burkhart, president of Brad Burkhart Christian Media and publisher of the newsletter, The PDAdvisor.  He said:

 

Christian radio may be more popular than you believe, possibly even in your area.  But first, let me clear up a misconception: Christian music comes in all flavors.  There is pop Christian music, rock Christian music, rap, jazz, hip-hop, and metal Christian music.  Plus, of course, the more traditional flavors of Gospel and Southern/Country Gospel.  The message is clearly different, but the musical package of Christian music can often sound familiar.  In fact, it’s not unlikely that you’ve heard Christian music this week without realizing it.

 

As to its popularity, according to Radio & Records, the #4 Adult Contemporary song in the country this week is a Christian song from a band that only does Christian music, “I Can Only Imagine” by Mercy Me.  In fact, this has been the #1 selling single on Billboard’s singles chart for the past three weeks.

 

Meanwhile, if you watch TV or rent DVDs, you likely have been exposed to Christian music on such shows as “The Practice,” “Alias,” MTV’s “Real World,” or in “Legally Blonde,” “Someone Like You,” and “Thin Red Line.”

 

While it may not be anyone you know, somebody is buying Christian music, and lots of it.  Based on statistics compiled by Nielsen SoundScan (the music industry’s standard for tracking record sales), the sales of Christian music during the first six months of this year were over 21 million units, representing 7.14% of all music sales, putting Christian music sales ahead of Latin, jazz, classical, and soundtracks.

 

I’m not sure that there is a way for research companies to statistically determine an individual’s sophistication quotient, so I can’t challenge your assertion that listeners in your area are too sophisticated to listen to Christian radio.

 

That said, MediaMark Research—whose consumer demographic research is used by 450+ advertising agencies, including 89 of the 100 largest—uncovered some interesting statistics when they compared the demographics of those who buy Christian CDs to the demographics of the U.S. population, for instance:

But alas, MediaMark doesn’t have a study on sophistication levels.

 

If you’re in radio, there is one thing about Christian radio that can be misleading: While the format has several notable commercial stations—KLTY/Dallas and WFSH/Atlanta come to mind—many of the format’s leading stations are owned by not-for-profit corporations and are classified by the FCC as non-commercial.  Accordingly, like NPR stations, they do not show up in standard Arbitron ratings reports.  Arbitron does measure their audience, but you have to dig it out of Maximizer or, if you’re a non-commercial station, you have to purchase the data through the Radio Research Consortium and can only use it in a highly restrictive manner that excludes releasing comparative data.

 

With that said, the information is there for those who take the time to dig.  In a significant number of major and mid-size markets, AC Christian stations are highly competitive in W25-54 and W35-54 demos, often with shares that rank them in the Top 5, sometimes Top 3 in the market.  And it’s not all TSL.  The California-based K-LOVE Radio Network, a non-commercial AC Christian network, has a weekly cume of 1,494,000 listeners according to Arbitron’s data.  (On top of those 1.5 million listeners, EMF, the company that owns K-LOVE, was just ranked by Arbitron as the 7th most listened to Internet broadcaster in September, with 1,259,729 hours of Total Time Spent Listening [TTSL].)

 

Christian radio is growing at a significant speed and already has a large and loyal audience.  I understand that you, as well as many people in mainstream radio, are not very familiar with Christian radio, but people who live on your street or stand in line next to you at the grocery store likely are.  And they’re listening.

 

Brad Burkhart

 

I’d like to thank Brad for his help.

 

As I indicated earlier, you are certainly entitled to your opinions.  Thanks for sending your question because you provided good examples of how “facts” are sometimes not facts at all, but just opinions—something people in all radio formats face every day (but opinions don’t cut the mustard in a scientific discussion).  I’m not for or against any type of radio station or format—I’m for all radio stations and all formats.  My final comment to you would be the same if you asked about any radio format, and that comment is: Get some facts, my friend.

 

By the way, Brad Burkhart didn’t mention this, but The PDAdvisor (no longer in publication) was Christian radio’s most popular trade and chart publication, and it’s free.

Christian Radio – A Comment

Thank you, Doctor, (and Brad Burkhart) for your eloquent defenses of Christian radio.  Some of us who are Christians are sick and tired of the snobs who believe that if you are a Christian, you must be a narrow-minded small-town hick, instead of a “sophisticated enlightened city-dweller.”  I guess this old stereotype is unfortunately alive and well in the 21st century.  Thanks again! - Anonymous

 

Anon:  You’re welcome for the answer, but I need to make a few comments about what you wrote.

 

First, although I know that many people either misunderstand or don’t know anything about Christian radio, my intent in my previous answer was not to defend Christian radio.  My intent was to point out misperceptions and fallacious arguments used in the person’s questions/comments.  It just so happened that the person criticized Christian radio.  I would have taken the same approach if the person criticized CHR, Classic Rock, or any other radio format (or anything for that matter).

 

As I said in my previous answer, we are free to have our own opinions, but when personal opinions (lacking valid and reliable data) are stated as fact, I think it’s necessary to point that out.  “Fact-less” personal opinions are the foundation of much of the “information” many people know—the stuff is based on unsupported personal opinions, sweeping generalizations, and all sorts of fallacious poppycock.  It’s why there are so many misperceptions and misunderstandings in radio, and it’s also why there are so many urban legends floating around—people think something IS, and therefore it must be true.  That don’t be right.

 

Secondly, while I don’t think your use of the word “snobs” is intended as an invective, I’m not sure I’d use the word to describe a person (or persons) who misunderstand or don’t know anything about Christian radio.  My experience is that there are many people who misunderstand and don’t know anything about every radio format.  Wait!  There are many people who misunderstand and don’t know anything about almost everything.

 

Does a misunderstanding or a lack of knowledge about something “make” a person a snob?  Oh, I don’t know.  I don’t think so.  I’d rather believe that the person is “informationally challenged” and needs to learn a few things.  We can’t know everything about everything, and these people just need to learn, that’s all.

 

The stereotype of Christian radio still exists in the 21st century?  Hmm.  I don’t find that surprising because there are a countless number of stereotypes about almost everything, including, but not limited to, religion, age, race, sex, nationality, and radio stations.  Many of these stereotypes have existed for hundreds or thousands of years.  With accurate and adequate information, stereotypes tend to disappear.

 

Don’t let the stereotypes about Christian radio get you down—we both know they exist along with all the other stereotypes.  The advantage for you is that you’re in Christian radio and you have the perfect opportunity to eliminate the stereotype by letting people know just what Christian radio is all about.  So…get going and help solve the problem.  Thanks for writing.

Christian Radio – News

Roger, thank you for this great column. I'm gaining valuable knowledge that I need as a young programmer to become the best radio programmer I can be. Thank you.

 

I'm at a small, Christian Contemporary Music AC station. A struggle I have is in how to handle news. We have a ‘news/talk’ AM station in town, and we’ve found that our listeners tune there (or the nearby big city news/talk) for news. My GM thinks we need news of some sort (outside of locally produced news on AM Drive) in PM Drive.

 

I disagree, as I feel that our listeners tune in to us for music and programs, and we found that our P1s don't rely on us for news. We have a wire service (that we use for AM Drive news), so if there's breaking news, we go live with the story. But I don't feel that a 2:00 p.m. recorded network ‘news headlines’ is worth the money. I'd prefer a news department and local news in PM Drive, but we don't have the budget for this (we're non-commercial and we're trying to save $$).

 

Being a young aspiring programmer, I'm open to criticism and the fact that I may be wrong about this. I still feel that our listeners are extremely loyal (and in some ways exclusive), and I don't want them to tune out because we DON'T have news. Music is our brand and I think that’s what we should focus on. Do you have any thoughts to help me out? Thanks." - Gameboy

 

Gameboy: Here are the facts as I read them:

 

1. Your GM wants network news highlights in PM drive; you don’t think it’s worth it.

2. You would rather have a news department but don’t have the money.

3. You’re not sure what to do, but you are sure that you don’t want listeners tuning out.

 

In your second paragraph, you say, "We have a news/talk AM station in town, and we’ve found that our listeners tune there (or the nearby big city news/talk) for news."

 

Here’s my answer: If you found out that your listeners tune to the AM News/Talk or the big city radio station, then find out if your listeners want news in PM drive.

 

Understand? You’re putting the cart before the horse trying to figure out which of two options is best, but you don’t know if either option is correct. Find out what your listeners want, and then argue about which approach is best.

Christian Radio Format

I live in a market that does not have a ‘Contemporary Christian’ formatted radio station that is music intensive. How would I go about convincing a station to change, or how would I go about starting up my own station within the market? I believe I have a ‘gimmick’ and marketing plan that will work. - Anonymous


Anon: You say that your market does not have a Contemporary Christian station that is music intensive. I can take this statement in two ways. First, the market doesn’t have a Christian station at all, and second, it has one, but the station is not music intensive. I’m not sure which you mean, so I have to take a guess. It appears that you have a few options.


Option 1: If there currently is a Christian station in the market, what you need to do is approach the management to discuss your ideas. Remember now, that you only have your opinion and that doesn’t mean much in reference to changing a format. Be prepared to back up your ideas with some type of research.


Option 2: If there currently isn’t a Christian station, you’re going to have to start from scratch. This means that you’ll have to contact the current radio station owners to find out if they are interested in selling. If they aren’t, you may be out of luck


Option 3: If there is a station for sale and you have the money to do it, then go for it. If you don’t have the money, you’re going to have to get financing. This means developing a detailed business plan, which includes research, and a lot of leg work contacting people who may be willing to put up the funds.


Whichever option you follow, you’re going to have to conduct research to support your ideas. However, you must be prepared for the research to indicate that there is no (or very little) chance for success for this type of station (or any other, for that matter).


By the way, you might look outside your market to other Christian radio stations. You might have some success in convincing them that your ideas are good.

 

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